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> Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!
Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!
@ 09:13 pm (GMT) |
Craig HenardFinally shot rifle today,results horrible!After using 3 rounds to get roughly sighted in at 100 yards I shot a 3 shot group . First shot hit the edge of bullseye,second shot 3 inches above first shot,third shot same elevation as second and half inch out to the right. I was upset to say the least! I noticed that on every shot the forend was coming up out of my left hand. I let barrel become cool to the touch and decided to use the Quake sling I have on the rifle. I shot it 3 more times with light to medium sling pressure and got a triangular group of 1 3/8 .Called it a day. Inspected bore again with Magnafying glass and bore light and there are some very light circumferential marks at Muzzle end of barrel and Very light Marks running the length of the bore on the Lands. Edges of lands look somewhat rough the length of the bore. There appears to be a tiny bit of copper fouling at the very muzzle end on one land(approximately 1/16 inch in length)I figure the factory has fired a total of 10 rounds or so and 9 rounds by me so say 19 rounds total. Range /100 yards Rest/2 bath towels folded on top of 10 inch high Metal wheel ramp with flat top ,shot from picnic table turned at angle so I could rest my shooting elbow . 10x42 Swfa scope Burris Signature Z rings tops torqued at approx 22 inch pounds with fat wrench. Burris Bases torqued to rifle at 20 inch pounds with Blue loctite Burris rings torqued to bases at 30 inch pounds with blue loctite. 1.75 pound trigger Front and rear stock bolts /50 inch pounds Front and Back Ammo/Hornady Superformance 154 grain SST Next step? Hand lapping bore with JB paste as per book?I guess I can only hand lap and not fire lap as I dont reload for the cartridge and want to use Factory ammo only? Increase or decrease torque on stock bolts ?Grease chassis and torque to more than 45 inch pounds per book? Less than 3 weeks till deer season here and I have to work on tent camper and 4 wheeler as well !! I eventually would like to achieve 1/2 inch groups with this rifle but for now would be happy with 3/4 or so. Thanks Craig |
Replies
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@ 09:20 pm (GMT) |
Craig HenardRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Oh by the way this is 7mm Remington Magnum |
@ 09:58 pm (GMT) |
Martin TaylorRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Craig you need a better rest than a picnic table and a few towels! That’s not going to help you at all, may sort of work for a .22 but not a magnum or any other cal.The muzzle jump you describe will throw out any groups fired regardless of rifle type. Muzzle jumps stock drops! Find a solid bench or prone if you are happy shooting that way, with a front sand bag & rear bag of either sand or similar, (small tip keep the sand damp not dry or to wet) use your sling and keep the barrel cool, then you will have results that you can measure the rifle from. Lapping will Nathans instuctions will help run the barrel in removing some of the high spots you can see, l think the factory only shoot a few rounds to test accuracy and it’s on its way. Let us know how you go. |
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@ 10:10 pm (GMT) |
Craig HenardRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Hi Martin,it is a Heavy wooden Picnic table.I am In the process of cutting up a pair of old jeans legs to fill with sand for some homemade sandbags. Will be trying them In a few days,maybe tommorow if I can get the woman of the house to sew them for me. Thanks for the tips ! Craig |
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@ 02:51 am (GMT) |
Craig HenardRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Well got 2 sandbags made ,instead of sewing them i just used zip ties .Legs cut 18 inches long ,after using the zip ties bags ended up being about 13 inches long full of sand.Bags aproximately 4.5 inches tall apice,9 inches or so stacked Going to try them tomorrow for two /3 shot groups.(not going to waste all my exspensive ammo to get the same results !)Hopefully results will be better. What size target should I be using at 100 yards? I was using a 2 inch red stick on dot today.Would I be better off using a square target? I could also see horizontal Movement of the reticle on the target with my heartbeat or pulse. I was breathing a couple of deep breaths and then letting out half to 3/4 of my breath and squeezing the trigger. I have had 2 heart attacks and a stint ,is there a better pattern of breath control and breaking the shot ? Thanks Craig |
@ 03:50 am (GMT) |
jasonRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!I find a square target shape helps me shoot a good group. Lining up the cross hair with a corner.I'm not sure of your experience, but don't be too down. I remember being the same with my first magnum. It not easy to pick one up and shoot a half inch group straight away. Stick at it, the rifle and yourself might settle into it. Then if your still not happy try another ammo. At least you have a good platform to build on now if the rifle doesn't settle down. |
@ 04:41 am (GMT) |
thomas kitchenRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!hi craig nathans put up a target for downloading on the knowledgebase under rifle accuracy if your interested. think practice practice practice which im sure most of us find hard with our daily lives getting in the way. let us know if groups get any better cheers |
@ 02:24 pm (GMT) |
Jim MoseleyRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!It's a Bell & Carlson stock, so you may want to check the torque settings. |
@ 04:42 pm (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!OK, lets just recap what some of the guys have said:Good bench set up. Try atleast two types of ammo. Suggest Blue Box Federal, Hornady 154gr SST SF and Hornady 162gr SST. Download targets from the rifle accuracy section of this site. Other jobs that may need to be looked at: Perform 1 o'clock test as per book series. Key area to watch for is a high spot in the stock, just infront of where the bolt hand sits. If in doubt, grind it out. Check to make sure the mag box is not pinched in place. Perform a proper break in procedure as per the book. Focus mostly on the throat area for now. JB paste is the last small step in this, not the first. Not willing to re-write the book her so please read through book carefully. Otherwise, it sounds like you have the rifle torqued up OK etc. It does take time as Jason said. You have already identified problems such as the forend jumping out of your hand- very good to be noticing these factors, will eventually pay great dividends. Too many people set unrealistic expectations. It takes time. Realistic expectations will help you transition to 1/2 or 3/4 MOA more smoothly, less frustration, no jumping to conclusions- a bad rifle etc. |
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@ 04:32 am (GMT) |
Craig HenardRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!I just got through sliding the scope(left tightened in rings) from the rifle to check the length of the front scope base screw and I had put Loctite blue 242 on the scope base screws and the crossbolt screws of the Burris Signature bases and rings.Do I need to remove any of the loctite from the screw threads and thread holes before reusing and if so how to remove? Also I just remove the front screw from the front base,can I just put the screw back in the base and torque to specs of do I need to loosen the other screw and start over? I assume the I can Just slide scope and rings back onto the base without having to remove from rings? Thanks Craig |
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@ 04:40 am (GMT) |
thomas kitchenRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!hi craig normally use heat to soften up loctite so you can remove bolts would pay to be careful not to over heat but since you already got them out would think you would be fine to just to give screws quick wipe with a rag then reapply loctite |
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@ 01:16 pm (GMT) |
Craig HenardRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!ThanksAny idea about whether I can just put the front base screw back in and torque down or whether I need to loosen the other screw first then alternate torqueing both as i did in initial installation? Thanks |
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@ 04:18 pm (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Hi Craig, its OK to remove one screw, then set it down again.If the scope bases are true- or especially if using a one piece base, there is no need to loosen and re-tighten scope rings. But this is a good point Craig. The slightest misalignment can place the scope under a high degree of stress so if you have time, just to be safe and if you are using two piece bases, it can pay to loosen the either the front or rear scope rings, then re-tighten. |
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@ 05:35 pm (GMT) |
Craig HenardRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Ok Nathan thanks.Nathan I am going to put a Different "Proven "scope on the rifle and fire a group just to check if by a long shot something is bad with the swfa 10x42 Mil quad I have on it . The scope I am going to try is a one inch scope and I have a set of Burris Signature ZEE 1 inch rings. I opened the package and there is some peel off friction tape with the instructions to put in bottom half of rings. I dont remember seeing any of this friction Tape in the 30mm ring package. Do I need to use the tape or just chunk it ? Thanks Craig |
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@ 07:21 pm (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!The tape will have the slightest amount of give. Will help prevent any alignment strain- not just anti friction. If its supplied, may as well use it. |
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@ 10:49 pm (GMT) |
Craig HenardRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Well shot the rifle with The Leupold 2 to 7 today,one three shot group off of sandags(front and rear) off of rest made out of cinder blocks (4 on each corner and plywood. Very steady.100 yards 3 shot group 2 inches. ugh 1st shot on bull,second shot 2 inches directly under first shot,3rd shot in line with first shot vertically and half inch to right. I have noticed this pattern for the past three (3 shot groups)I have shot. Factory test target when it came back from factory recently also had 2 within an inch and one 1 3/4 inch below. Dont know which order they were shot in though. I am going to glue and stick bed it and use the barrel break in procedure when I get the materials rounded up For now though what could be the reason for this type of grouping? I am taking care as far as bench technique goes ,although I notice using the sling that rifle has a tendency to roll to the right . Thanks Craig |
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@ 11:36 pm (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Nothing can be said at the moment. Too early.Your job list: Lap lug you mentioned, then even up both- as per book. Bore lapping procedure. Double check for high spot in stock forward of bolt handle cut out through to the beginning of the ejection port. Look for shiny spots on the action in this area too. I want to see that free floating. Front of mag box- consider quick lick with file along bottom edge with bias towards the front. Then file a light chamfer at the front and some of the sides to help guide it into the floor plate recess. Glue Screw. Job time- a half Saturday? Trial various ammo. There is a recent post on here from Ron in Australia, his family came for a day tutorial. The youngest shot 3" vertical, I was able to help him get down under a half inch. It's an example of technique as a potential issue if you are not used to this level of recoil. I can probably give you some pointers over the phone, could be something seemingly minor- silly things catch us all out. You have my number. Work hours please. I expect you to call please. Still very busy here meeting deadlines. Please and sorry, this is not an open invitation to every Tom to phone me during this time period. A young fella rang at 930pm the other night to ask how tight is too tight when checking bedding. 10/10 for enthusiasm, 0/10 for timing. I love to help but can only do so much and answer so many emails etc. Best way I can help many people is to try and knock the book series over in a timely manner. |
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@ 11:53 pm (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Here is the area to check for potential high spots (especially where the ali is exposed). Sorry- extends both behind and in front of the bolt handle cut out.
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@ 02:35 am (GMT) |
Craig HenardRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Heres a couple of pics,I put woman of the house lipstick in stock and set barreled action in stock.Here is where lipstick stuck to reciever.Is this supposed to be contacting at all or is action supposed to just contact at tang and front of reciever on ali block?Other pic is of how barrel sits in stock.I can pass a dollar bill under stock all the way back to reciever but it definetly not sitting in center of stock . Nathan how hard is it to remove barreled action from glue and stick bedding if I decide to go ahead and use this method? Thanks Craig PS, enjoyed talking with you. |
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@ 02:42 am (GMT) |
Craig HenardRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !! 
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@ 03:29 pm (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Hi Craig, that (somewhat poor fit) is normal. Its what I refer to as bars (like saddle bars) in the book. Hence why it is best to adopt one bedding system or another as described.Just keep working through the job list. Your'e doing fine. |
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@ 03:32 pm (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Sorry, forgot to answer your second question: Easy. If you use SP-400 (CRC Soft seal), you will be just fine. Not too heavy, not too light- just an even spray coating, let it dry, then do your thing. Just follow the book instructions. |
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@ 09:06 pm (GMT) |
Craig HenardRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!I shot the rifle yesterday without the magazine box.first shot then second shot almost 2 inches directly above the first 3rd shot 2 inches to right of 2nd shot 4th shot 2 inches below 3rd ,horrible ! Went looking for lug lapping and only found a general valve lapping tube ,no mention of fine or grit,passed on this.Found maroon 3m general purpose Scotchbrite pad #7447.Guess I will have to order lapping compound ! Found Federal Blue box 150 Grain ammo and bought a box. Changed back to original SWFA scope. Changed from using half a concrete block under sandbag Took some sand out of sanbags(I had stuffed my homemade sandbags so full they looked like they were about to pop !) Changes sling from wide Quake sling (Felt maybe the the rubber material was to inflexable and maybe contacting bags in a negative way)to old military type claw adjustable sling.Medium tension double wrap around arm. Changed to 1inch orange dot from 2 inch dot. 1st shot approx 1.5 inch above target Second shot almost touching 1st 3rd shot slightly above 1st and second shot Total group size slightly less than .5 inch !! I am a happy shooter now ! BUT I would like some diagnosis Although I have known that ammo changes can and do make a difference it is hard to believe that the rifle could go from being so erratic with the ammo change alone? AND I am wanting the performance of the Hornady so I will try more shooting with the Hornady tommorow. IF the Hornady still shoots like a shotgun will the Blue box Federal be okay for up to 500 yard Deer hunting ? Thanks Craig |
@ 10:39 pm (GMT) |
Bob MavinRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Hi CraigA lot of variables there mate. If you want to test different ammo you need to test them all without changing anything, the only variable being the ammo. Then change only one thing at a time till you isolate what the problem is. Repeat exactly what you did to get .5 group but with the other ammo. I don’t think the ammo is the problem. Bob |
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@ 11:50 pm (GMT) |
Craig HenardRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Hi Bob,Yes a lot of variables there for sure. Up until now this rifle has been the worst shooting rifle I have ever shot in my 44 plus years of shooting(I am 54 now). Now in the span of a day (with the variables I outlined)I just shot my BEST 3 shot group ever ! I have had several sporter weight rifles shoot 3 shot .75 inch groups (mostly Remington 700 rifles) I am just so glad that I am able to shoot a group with this rifle instead of a Pattern ! Heck for all I know it was the lipstick I put inside the stock(to test for binding and high spots)although I did rub it off with a paper towel. Perhaps it left enough residue to allow the action to go back and forth in battery to help accuracy ? At least this group (albeit being only ONE 3 shot group)does kinda tell me the rifle is not a dud (to be honest was worried it was). Anyway thanks for your input and advice Bob. Craig |
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@ 11:52 pm (GMT) |
Martin TaylorRe: Nathan and others ,Finally got a chance to shoot new Remington 700 stainless long range rifle,extreemly dissapointed !!Well done for sticking it out Craig, you are starting to see results from your all efforts. Nathans advice has worked out well for you!Bob is spot on you have changed to many variables so see how your re-test go's when you back track. Sorry never thought to tell you to lightly fill the bags, you need to be able to mould them a bit, thats why l suggested damp sand. The Automotive valve grinding paste will work, if you search around some tubes come with a fine & coarse paste at either ends, l have found the fine is the go for most, but follow your book instructions CAREFULLY you don’t want to score the lugs or receiver. |
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