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> Youth Rifles
Youth Rifles
@ 11:27 pm (GMT) |
Allen MaysI have been enjoying reading the knowledge base articles, particularly the caliber specific articles. While I appreciate that there is a point to address the muzzle velocity from a modern 22" barrel instead of a 24" test barrel, I noticed that there is not any information addressing the current 20" youth barrels made by Savage, Remington, Ruger, Marlin, and others. Although certain "rules of thumb" can be applied, these are often inaccurate. Longer burning powders such as Hornady's Superformance or Remington's Hypersonic complicate this even more. Is there any data about the true performance of ammunition in these shorter barrels in the popular youth calibers - 243, 223, 7mm-08, and 308? |
Replies
@ 11:57 pm (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: Youth RiflesHi Allen, this is just generally speaking. I have noticed that the new Superformance loads, even though the burn rate is very slow, yield enough energy to keep velocities high, losing around only 20fps per inch of barrel removed down to 20".All of the cartidges you mentioned are in themselves extremely efficient. I find that if a barrel is slow, it will be slow regardless of length. I also find that if a factory ammuntion is slow, adding barrel length may not help a great deal. If we are talking about youth rifles though- running Superformance loads in a youth rifle may not be the best if the rifle is intended for a youth. It can be better to run a slow hand load with a bullet that works well at the proposed velocities. Example- .308 loaded with a 130 grain bullet at 2400fps for practice with a final goal of loading the 168gr A-Max at the same 2400fps for general use to 200-300 yards. By the way guys, I am having a few problems with Superformance powder. A couple of readers were not able to duplicate factory loads with Superformance so I am working through this now. My initial assumption is that the current SF powder available to hand loaders differs from the factory powder and or Leverevolution powder may be being used in some bolt action factory loadings but factory loads are then labelled as being Superformance. This is all a bit disconcerting at this stage. Its going to take me quite some time to get to the bottom of it all. |
@ 02:55 am (GMT) |
im2lazyRe: Youth RiflesHi Nathan, when I was chasing loads for the 308 I found out that the factory loads use different blends of the Superformance powder. There seems to be quite a variety of powders that are not yet available to hand loaders.Tikka now have a T3 youth size available also. On a side note, in a 7-08 using Superformance 139gr SST I get 2840 f/sec out of 17 inch barrel. |
@ 04:35 am (GMT) |
PeterRe: Youth RiflesHi all thats fast for a 17in ,my 20 in a7 7mm08 with same ammo is 2806 av and my 20 in 5r 308 with sf factory 168 amax 2666 .my hand loads with sf powder are so slow i have given up with this powder ie 2300 with same weight powder 48.6 and 168 amax . |
@ 05:42 am (GMT) |
Bob MavinRe: Youth RiflesHi PeterI found ADI 2206H very good in my 20" 308 I was getting 2900 fps with 150gn pills Bob |
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@ 03:20 pm (GMT) |
PeterRe: Youth RiflesThanks Bob ,have been using adi2206h with the 168 amax for 2730 - 2750 ,and yes I'm keen to try the 150s cheers. |
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@ 04:41 pm (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: Youth RiflesIt annoyes me. When Norma MRP came out, they made a hot load for the Swede doing 2750fps (hot for factory). Then they sold the MRP powder and in the load manual, they showed the powder charge which was the same charge as the factory load.When Grame Henry was giving advice for Rod & Rifle, besides his own pet loads, if a person wrote in and asked Graeme for a load to duplicate Norma (because Norma generally had the hottest loadings on the Market), all Graeme had to do was refer to the Norma manual and there it was. I think some of this still stands today (Norma online data). Then Hornady come along and gave us a bunch of hot factory loads, then sell us the powder to supposedly duplicate the loads. When it first came out, I came across load data quoted (where I have no idea) which I never cut and pasted. It would be interesting to compare now. I will pull more loads shortly and compare to the current SF powder. My thanks to Glenn Edwards for supplying me with a batch of conflicting powder and ammo to study. |
@ 02:38 am (GMT) |
Mike DavisRe: Youth Riflesif you have a surf around the net re hornady powder you will find there are heaps of different ones out there and only one available to reloaders.frustrating for you tinkerers to be sure. |
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@ 01:03 am (GMT) |
Allen MaysRe: Youth RiflesThanks to all for the info. The reasons I posed the question are two fold. First I am considering a pronghorn hunt, and I was thinking about using my son's 243. I have a 30-06 with a wood stock and was wanting to use something that was both lighter to carry and most of all the right caliber for such light game (around 100 lb). Second, I am considering purchasing a 7mm-08 as my son grows. I like the caliber, but I don't want to give up much performance in the shorter barrel if possible. To be totally honest he may have to share the 7mm with me since I am not a big guy at only 150lb. The 06 is just a little too punishing at the range.Nathan, I appreciate your insight on using a light loading for practice, too. Most of his practice is with a 223 as he is very comfortable with the recoil and can spend a lot of rounds working on technique and reproducing shot placement. We typically finish the day with 1 or 2 3-shot groups with the 243 using standard factory loads to make sure he is transferring technique regardless of which gun is in his hands. |
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@ 05:14 pm (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: Youth RiflesHave a look at this when you get a chance Allen:http://www.tikka.fi/t3models.php?compact_showdata#pagedown |
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