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> Precision long range hunting and shooting
> 300 WSM in a long action
300 WSM in a long action
@ 12:05 pm (GMT) |
rob.vHi Nathan,Have been shooting the 300 win mag sendero over the last 12 months with the 208 A-max with great results. Bedded with your compound the gun shoots under half moa.. I have followed your instructions with the lapping of the barrel from your book and polishing. Still after proper running in, I get a maximum of 10 very accurate shots and then they start to open up. Rarely often putting more than 10 shots out in a session,, But it can sometimes take hours to clean. Now im considering rebarreling to the 300WSM and did some measurements with the 208 A-Max that i need a COAL of around 3.1inches, this will leave the boat tail just below the neck allowing more powder room... What is the ideal scenario as far as how much bullet can be below the neck? Also im finding there isn't any guns that will accomodate this long length in the 300WSM hence im thinking of rebarelling my sendero long action to the 300WSM. Will i be having issues with feeding is my biggest concern..?? Keep up the good work.. Cheers Rob. |
Replies
@ 08:35 pm (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: 300 WSM in a long actionHi Rob, your proposed COAL sounds OK. As long as you have around 20 thou below the case shoulder, it will ensure that you do not get the dreaded donut and have some room for throat wear and re-seating etc.As you say, feeding will be the main issue. You'll need to see if you can find a part box of ammo or borrow some ammo from a friend and check feeding in your individual rifle. Mimic recoil by jolting the rifle. Feeding could present a major problem. This project may not be a go. Both length and width are issues. Perhaps also consider contacting Wyatt and see if they have walked any clients through this before. The short answer is of course to rebarrel to .300 Win Mag. I would also be reluctant to rebarrel your rifle just yet. You try moly coating projectiles or even as a very rudimentary test, try 'shake in the bag seasoning' your projectiles with some powdered graphite, then shoot over CRC Long Life (CRC SP-350). There are a few ideas you could play with in this regard. |
@ 08:39 pm (GMT) |
Bob MavinRe: 300 WSM in a long actionHi RobIf you intend to shoot 208's long range I'd stay with 300WM that holds a bit more powder. I'm not sure but I think you'd have feeding prob's with the shorter WSM in the long action with rails set up for the longer 300win mag. Bolt face may need opening up too for the bigger dia WSM case. Cheers Bob |
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@ 11:12 pm (GMT) |
robert valeriRe: 300 WSM in a long actionHi Guys thanks for the responses..Nathan i have been doing the shoot over the CRC long life on this rifle with bullets coated with the HBN (white graphite) results are still the same, Haven't tried moly.. Just emailed Wyatts with my situation will wait for their response.. If I go to a magazine i really would like it flush, H-S precision do i nice flush mount magazine assembly so that could be another option.. I believe the rim diameters of the 2 cases are within .002 of each other so bolt face shouldnt be an issue, the base diameter of the case on the WSM is .020 bigger than the Win Mag so i guess this is where i need to pay close attention to magazine fit etc.. cheers.. rob. |
@ 11:50 pm (GMT) |
Martin TaylorRe: 300 WSM in a long actionRob l have the exact same results with my Police 300wm, bloody frustrating, worse than anything l have seen. Blazingly accurate then out to .75moa very quickly followed by a lengthy cleaning session.What is you round count? Mine is starting to show small signs of improvement at approx. 200. I also have lapped etc. etc. Too your question, l have been told the conversion is relatively straight forward with race opening but please don't take that as gospel! As Nathan has said why not just re-barrel to 300wm again if that is your next move? The 300wm is a well proven LR cal that will most likely squeeze a little more velocity with the bigger pills than the wsm. You are set up & know it already. |
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@ 04:15 am (GMT) |
rob.vRe: 300 WSM in a long actionHi Martin..Im a couple hundred rounds down the tube also.. Initially i was struggling to reach a decent velocity and finding early signs of pressure with the loads then Nathan suggested using remington brass and a std large rifle primer which helped. My bolt lift is effortless but the initial pull back of the bolt can sometimes be stiff,, i honestly believe from countless inspections that this bolt lacks primary extraction i reckon if i move the bolt handle a touch my problems may be solved.. Velocity is just nudging the 2800fps mark. One thing if i full length resize a fired case i cannot rechamber that round unless i run it through a Belted Magnum Collet Resizing Die from Innovative Technologies. Maybe the reamer was old and a bit worn and the chamber is tight but with out that special die i cannot get resized cases to chamber. Well thanks for your thoughts.. I may just stick with the WIn Mag and get myself a decent barrel.. Occasionally i like to use it at the range so 10 accurate shots just isn't enough.. cheers. |
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@ 04:50 am (GMT) |
Bob MavinRe: 300 WSM in a long actionHave you tried marking your case to see where it's binding? Could be tight in in the neck caused by a doughnut on the inside? |
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@ 05:11 am (GMT) |
Martin TaylorRe: 300 WSM in a long actionYours and mine are sisters Rob!I do not neck size due to exactly what you describe, binding around the base. l F/L every time with Redding S type dies, bump to the absolute minimum, then neck size with the bushing die, zero problems now. I am yet to be convinced by neck sizing only, l know that will raise a few eyebrows and maybe draw a few get real comments! I F/L size all my cals with a range of die brands and have no feed or extraction issues because they are all hunting rifles and l don't like the stiff bolt feel....... not the only way to do things just personal likes l guess. I have a love hate relationship with my 300wm, just like l imagine you do! |
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@ 05:43 am (GMT) |
rob.vRe: 300 WSM in a long actionHi Guys..Haven't tried marking the case sounds like an option,, i wasn't convinced its the neck because when i run the belted mag die after resizing it chambers fine this is telling me its right down near the belt.. I do neck size after all the other sizing is done using a Lee collet neck die.. cheap die but seems very consistant and have checked runout after doing this and it seem to be as good as anything many more time as expensive.. Ok i just had some WSM brass in my hands and have some info for anyone contemplating the idea of the WSM in a long action. This is entirely in relation to the 208 A-MAX.. It will feed absolutely fine from a hinged floor plate setup.. You will need to open up the internal rails in the action a touch to top feed. Bolt face i did some measurements the rim is fine and will fit in your bolt and under the extractor.. You have to watch out for the base of the case to make sure you are 100% against the bolt face.. it seemed fine but i think the face would have to be opened up a touch.. maybe maybe not but it certainly something that needs your attention.. starting to lean more towards sticking with the WIN MAG... for now. cheers rob. |
@ 06:17 am (GMT) |
Thomas KitchenRe: 300 WSM in a long actionhi guys this is making very interesting reading.wondering if 308 norma magnum could be another option http://www.ballisticstudies.com/Knowledgebase/.308+Norma+Magnum.html very similar dimensions to 300 win mag but shorter, not sure if you could start with 308 norma mag and then ream to 300 win mag when the throat starts to wear?. the other question i was wondering could you get the chamber re reamed with brand new reamer in 300 win mag to make sure its right, if there's no improvement at least you would have a reamer for your new barrel?. sorry not much help to you rob but couldn't resist an opportunity to learn. |
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@ 06:57 am (GMT) |
Bob MavinRe: 300 WSM in a long actionI do the same Martin. Once you get a tight case, I dismantle the bolt for better feel, wipe the case with a little smear of imperial sizing lube, then adjust the F/L die a 1/8 of turn at a time until the bolt only just closes nicely. Then that's it, leave it set at that. |
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@ 09:50 pm (GMT) |
Martin TaylorRe: 300 WSM in a long actionYep same Bob, have had excellent results with cheap and expensive dies setting them exactly as you discribe on many cals & rifle brands. Set once and forget, all locked up tight in a quick change Hornady bushings.I have tested my 300wm in many ways which Nathan knows all about due to me chewing on his ear on many occasions. Always binds just above the belt, neck & shoulder are spot on. Sizing die & chamber tolerances have to work together and if they are at oposite ends of their tolerances this could be the cause of what you are experiencing Rob. Measure a case above the belt from your sizing die and l'll measure one of mine tonight, will be interesting to see if our dies are similar. I have collet dies that have just been set up on 2 cals, doing it out of interest as both shoot very well already, just pushing boundries a bit and l know Nathan rates them highly! Just need to get to the range.......grrrr. |
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@ 01:54 pm (GMT) |
rob.vRe: 300 WSM in a long actionSomething Interesting has happened..Tried the loads i know shoot good again on Saturday.. 208 A-MAX coated in HBN , Loads were Jumped .010 and .030 both grouped half moa and just under. The Bloody bolt opened fine No stiff bolt pull.. Now the temperature was at least 15degrees cooler than the last time i testes so between the cooler temps and the bullet coatings it seemed to cycle fine.. Not only that with the coated bullets i got tight groups out to shots 16,17,18 then started to open so im nearly at double the round count to before and holding accuracy.. Maybe i just need to persevere with it for a while and keep at it.. No doubt the accuracy is there and long shot strings are not required so i should be happy with that. Martin will get some measurements done this week but i played around with the full length die before and cannot chamber a round after sizing with the full length die,, that Belted magnum collet die is the only way i can chamber that brass.. Cheers. |
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@ 08:44 pm (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: 300 WSM in a long actionGood to hear, I had wondered if bullet coating would help.That really is great news. |
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@ 09:39 pm (GMT) |
Martin TaylorRe: 300 WSM in a long actionI have found the Berger 210's to foul worse than the 215's....... not sure why, but that’s what they do! They all measure the same so l have put it down to copper compound. Amax’s seem to be slightly better and 20 odd rounds seems to be my upper limit now, bloody painful but gee’s it shoots well until then. I haven’t tried coating things Rob but that’s definitely an option as you have shown. I’m happy with that count as it’s a hunting rig and l do most my training with my 308 Rem that will shoot well all day long.I read about those magnum seizers when l was researching which calibre to run, but have had no problems using the Redding seizer so didn’t look into it any further. I measured my cases yesterday and noticed the Hornady has a smaller ring above the belt compared to my Winchester brass. I didn’t write down my measurements so will have to recheck them before l list a size! I find the ambient temps will also effect extraction, but that’s the price for all the extra go l guess. |
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