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Managing the wet - weather, rain gear and methods
@ 02:07 pm (GMT) |
Fernando CundinTo all:A recent extended hunt was a wet weather experience and brought up some ideas for wet weather rain gear that works, vs the general fail that was this past week long wet suffering. I used HH Impertech rain jacket and pants and thought I was well equipped. The Louisiana wet defeated the impermeable gear in short order. Fortunately the temps were mostly mild so you could keep going even if all soggy. A good tip from an Alaskan hunter put me on to the HH Impertech gear and I was mostly satisfied in most rain events that I have experienced. This past week though was a gully washer and the rain suit was simply not up to task. In fact, maybe no rain gear is up to the task of a Louisiana wet show over an extended period. New Zealand hunters that I have contacted say that "when it's wet, just be wet" and they explained some of the terrain and wet conditions they encounter crossing streams and constantly running in total wet everything. Louisiana though can be mild in temps one minute and then 30 min. later drop some 20-30 degrees after a front passes. If you are all soaked you are more than miserable, you might then be inline for hyperthermia. Stable anything and Louisiana just do not mix. I long ago gave up on anything cotton and have nearly all synthetic everything. Wool sweater is still a good idea, but not during anything so soaking as this week past. Fleece warms reasonably well in wet, and the faster drying time is the advantage. Long ago in the infantry we were issued wet weather OD green rain suits that were mostly worn out. These were impermeable jacket pant combos that were tough, simple and mostly waterproof, PVC something over a tough course fabric. Later we were issued the new GoreTex gear and it shortly revealed many weaknesses. Mainly the GoreTex saturated and lost all breathability and impermeability. Drying out GoreTex in the field was nearly impossible. The old rain suits were an advantage with a strict impermeable coating that would allow for body heat to dry out your BDU's as worn in a few hours. Once GoreTex saturates through - yer done. So I had great hopes with the Impertech Helly Hansen gear that it would perform more like the old OD green Army rain suits but with less weight more breathability (vent flap back design) and some stretch. Louisiana wet defeated the HH gear in short order. These are some of the notes from this past week. I am curious to learn best solutions and ideas from the forum. My best idea is now HH Mandal workwear rain suits and wear light synthetics underneath. The Mandal style gear is the closest thing to the old US Army issued OD rain gear.(Vietnam era tech). This is only empirical looking back and I can only test the Manual HH gear and see. Being wet is part of the hunt. Being wet for a whole week is a character test. Being wet and missing out on a better option is something that I hope to correct. Best FC |
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@ 10:44 am (GMT) |
Steph FosterRe: Managing the wet - weather, rain gear and methodsHi Fernando, I think this is a great topic.I couldn't tell you how many hours I have spent hunting in the rain! However there are hunts and there are hunts. Going out in the rain for a couple of hours is no big deal, you are going to get wet but you know you are coming home to a hot shower so no big deal. Spending a week in the bush in torrential rain is however, an entirely different proposition! There has been a tradition amid New Zealand hunters for - I don't know how long, and that is to wear a pair of shorts over a pair of long john / thermal pants. Truly traditional garb for the original New Zealand bushmen was actually a woolen blanket worn kilt style. The idea behind long johns and shorts is simply that the light, thin wool / polyprop of the long johns is not heavy when wet, retains a level of warmth when wet and also dries out very fast, going from very wet to merely damp within an hour or two. This style of garb is so common here that I remember talking to a Himalayan mountain guide once who laughingly told me he could always tell a kiwi in one glance by the long johns and shorts! When I go hunting I wear my long johns, a light pair of shorts on the bottom (light meaning material that won't stretch and become heavy when saturated) also adding a good set of knee length gators. On top I wear a thermal base layer and then a slightly heavier fleece and then a final warm wool layer. This is my standard hunting attire regardless of the duration of my planned hunt. If I am going out for a day hunt and it looks like it is going to rain then I add an army issue gortex rain jacket. I find this jacket is perfectly adequate for a day hunt and also works well as a good wind breaker. If however I am going on an extended hunt and will be tramping or carrying a lot of gear in a pack, well then, I like to take an army issue poncho. The poncho is perfect because it goes over all of your gear, pack included. It's a bit like wearing a tent. So my kit list for an extended hunt is two pairs of long johns - one that I wear in the day that can stay wet all day, and the second that I wear at camp and in bed. Because the thermals dry so fast it is no big deal putting the day thermals back on in the morning, they may be slightly damp but they will still be warm. Whatever top layers I need for the time of the year (winter vs summer etc), I will always have two thermal tops, again one for the day and then a dry one for camp and bed. A good warm outer jacket and then a water proof poncho to go over the lot. This is overly simplified but you get the point. Like most New Zealander's, I think when you hunt in the rain - you are going to get wet. The trick is to wear gear that makes being wet no big deal. For me, light warm gear that does not become heavy and saggy when saturated and can dry fast makes all the difference. By using light thin layers you can carry more of them, two or three pairs of long johns versus one heavy cumbersome pair of wet weather trousers - trousers that may take a whole day to dry. At the end of the day nothing beats a pair of long johns and a poncho! Also you have to realize that most hunts in New Zealand will entail at least one river crossing. I have been on hunting trips that required us to cross a river up to forty times, the crossings varied from knee deep to up to my ribs - there is no staying dry in those circumstances so once again the long john system is perfect. A pair of light weight flip flops (foam not rubber due to weight) are also my go to for camp shoes as a break from wet boots. Nathan has a video on youtube that shows him wearing our standard hunting gear. There is also a picture of me in The Practical Guide To Long Range Shooting. Cheers, Steph. https://youtu.be/gJ-V4g69qgw |
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@ 04:27 pm (GMT) |
Fernando CundinRe: Managing the wet - weather, rain gear and methods - a follow up and customer service noteSteph,I had a look at the video. I was familiar with that piece already, but this second viewing for the hunting garb, look see and a new frame of mind... Ahhh, Louisiana, gotta' love the place. Rotten with variety, complexity and challenge. It is not a State but a State of Mind. Hmm, the stretch leggings, gaiters, boots, nylon shorts and the the rest of it. I see the application and trust your experience and the Kiwi ways. The matter is to draw from some suggestions, have a good think and take from the sources perhaps some new items and tips to try in the field, test and see what sort of report can be made. I will be headed out again for another week long hunt soon. I made a call to Helly Hansen customer service to relay the issue of the rain suit fail and ask some open ended questions and see what might come back in a conversation. The fellow was nice enough, but I think that he is more of a generalist and not the field grizzled old salt that I was hoping to tap into. There is a warranty claim option, if that seems prudent. There is no surface treatment or special care that needs to be applied to the Impertech "skin". Overall I'm not doing anything wrong... It was not recommended that I go with the workwear Mandal suit as it would only be a sauna inside if there is any exertion, especially in mild temps. Gaiters I like. I have a heavy wool ol' skool set best for mountain applications and a synthetic set for everything else. They nylons work well stopping the kind of wet that happens when walking through heavy wet grass where the water gets forced into the trousers and boots. Vegetation here can be a biting affair with wait-a-min vines and all kinds of abrasive briars that chew legs like chainsaws. So I think the thermal leggings are a NO GO. Poncho is an old friend. It can be an ungainly thing in tight bush, but it is simple enough to pull out at a rest and throw over you or stand up a quick hooch if you get a monsoon event. I think I will pack it this time. I have a new heavy set of mostly synthetic work trousers to test out. They have cargo pockets on the legs and double knees, look tough and seem to fit the task. These with the option of light poly underneath for cooler temps and that might be a GO for the lower half. The HH Impertech is getting another fielding. It had best stand up to its reputation! I have inspected it thoroughly for seam tape issues or anything that would explain the total fail, it is all still a product mystery. I have a Gore Tex jacket, bring it along as back up. And there you are. So, the Kiwi look in Louisiana? I dunno... hunting in the dark bush/swamp you have most of the place all to yourself, especially the back corners that I seek out. Stopping for gas or ice along the way... well, lets see... I'll watch the video through again a few times and practice the Kiwi accent just enough so I can pull off the whole persona. I'm going to have to play it all the way or somebody will make a call on me around here. Best to all. FC |
@ 01:44 pm (GMT) |
Scott StruifRe: Managing the wet - weather, rain gear and methodsHi Fernando. I live a half mile from Autzen Stadum, home of the Oregon Ducks. It rains here a lot during the deer and elk season. Here, I could stop at a convenience store in the boonies with a dress on, carrying a purse, without raising an eyebrow, but I understand your concern with the shorts-over-leggings in your neck-of-the-woods. I agree, Gortex is a waste of money for hunting. If you’re going to hunt all day, get a rubberized raincoat and pants or overalls from Tingley or Carhartt. Some complain rainwear is noisy, but I haven’t found that to be true of the rubber materials. They’re pliable. If you’re still hunting through brush, it’s stepping on a stick and breaking it that is the concern. Similarly with boots. If you want to keep rain out, wear Northerners. Sure, you’ll be walking on what feels like sliced bologna at the end of the day, but your feet will be warm. On the coat, get one without a hood, and a hat that keeps the rain off your neck. I tried a pith helmet like mailmen wear, but the noise was annoying . . . not that I was a afraid deer would hear it, but I heard every drop. In Gortex’s defense, I found a Gortex hat similar to the one they wear in NZ. One of those leather Aussie hats would probably work, too. |
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@ 08:02 am (GMT) |
Fernando CundinRe: Managing the wet - weather, rain gear and methodsScott, yes... the Pacific North West is some equally suck weather as Louisiana. I recall many a night in Ft Lewis with nothing on my mind but full body soak and a full review my life choices, ahhh gotta love the Infantry.An additional item that I wish to bring attention to has to with wet management. Ideally we should like to prevent getting wet, but if the Gods deem that idea not likely then mitigating the wet with synthetics is a GO. NZ bush wear with poly legs and shorts knows this already. I spend a good amount of money buying Patagonia Capellene poly first layer items, and they work! The exciting colours were nothing too applicable for patrolling the DMZ in Korea, but the tech was smart and effective. A high exertion situation in cold or rapidly changing cold near and around freezing can be a tough spot. There is one limitation, other than the cost, the Patagonia garments pilled terribly and under hard use they ended up less than Infantry tough. Lately I have been using Adiddas Climacool garments for the same purpose and application (not Korea). These were noticed from my boy's soccer days and I thought to give it a try. The slick to the touch feel and the almost no drape cut and fit is where some the tech is. I can say from only just recent experience that these undergarments do wick moisture and do dry rapidly from a soak state to plenty dry in about an hour. Feeling clammy for a period is OK if you then know that later you will be dry-ish and ready for more. There may be similar garments, cheaper or better suited for hunting, but the Adidas items that I have and use are about the best undergarments that I have to suggest and recommend. I have a set of the sport socks on order and will hope to try these in the field. I expect good performance as all the Adiddas sport stuff is a solid construction and tech so far. Best FC |
@ 05:38 pm (GMT) |
Jon ShortRe: Managing the wet - weather, rain gear and methodsBreathability is the key with any wet weather gear in my mind. Layers underneath. You are going to get wet no matter what you do. & if you are working reasonably hard as is path of the course with any hunting, wet from sweat under the garment too. Your body heat & decent ventilation should help expel that trapped steam though.I am the typical Kiwi hunter...I expect to get a little wet whilst staying warm, but expect the jacket to keep the worst of the rain out, & ventilate to release the sweaty steam! Some of the jackets we have here now have numerous vent locations like under the arms etc. Ventilation is crucial from my perspective. Not too worried about the legs, so long as the important bits stay warm & relatively dry that's what really matters. Yeah I am not a fan or GoreTex either. Breathable my anus! |
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@ 12:22 pm (GMT) |
Fernando CundinRe: Managing the wet - weather, rain gear and methods - field updateTwo notions and observations to share.Wicking and transportation is some marketing jive that might have some specific merit and some notes to mark. The Adidas sports performance material does a good job of wicking moisture and releasing it out and away form the skin. Recent socks trial was positive, but only half way (up). The sports oriented designs makes for some hunting specific constraints. Hunt in rubber knee boots? Then optimally select socks that rise above the height of the boot tops to best release the moisture as built up in the boot from exertion. The shorter than optimal sports socks that I tried recently only brought up the damp only so far. I will keep searching for an optimal rubber knee boot sock for warm temps. Tough synthetic work pants do wet in the wet. They breathe well in warm temps and dry fast enough even if the rapid cooling effect can be felt, at least you know there is some drying going on. Louisiana briars have a say though on the long term resiliency of the fabric. Just how many seasons are possible? Curbing or choosing new routes through tough bush just to save the pants is not going to happen. Briar tough pants and bibs that are designed specifically for busting through briars is another alternative. The pants fabric weave is the matter. The weave that is tight enough to shrug off the hooks of briars is likely what's going on in detail. So selecting for wet management leads to a more open fabric weave that Velcro's briars more easily, ahhh the quest continues. For general hunting duty the Wrangler ATG winter weight synthetic pants are a GO. Best to all. |
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